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TOPIC: New keyboard !!!! E-X20

New keyboard !!!! E-X20 02 Dec 2017 01:21 #6437

  • aviro
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Just a few hours ago i see a new arranger keyboard appear on the Roland.com site.

No introduction, No releas or what ever on the site it's just ad there in the arranger section!!!!

E-X20 it's a beginner keyboard focus on kids play but all by all 600 sounds 350 style's not bad.

what can we suggest !!! (reading the line "The E-X20 is the ideal first step")
E-a7 is the last arrranger ......now we start with a E-x20 Will this be a new range of arrangers for 2018 E-x60 ,E-x80 ?????????????

NEW!


note bk3 and bk5 discontinued on february 2018
Last Edit: 02 Dec 2017 17:09 by aviro.
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New keyboard !!!! E-X20 02 Dec 2017 19:02 #6439

  • Diki
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Thing is, read the specs. Absolutely nothing new. This isn't a 'first step'.

This is a last step.

Roland's arranger line is currently ONE model if you don't count the 'toy' line. Old stock of remaindered BK models don't count, IMHO. There is the E-A7, and that, folks, is basically it. A $1200 arranger, so by Yamaha or Korg standards, not even a MOTL (S970 is about $2000). No mid-price, no TOTL, no nothing.

Don't get me wrong, at its price point, the E-A7 is amazing value for money, and maybe that is Roland's strategy... Offer a MOTL arranger at BOTL price. But Roland shoot themselves in the foot (as always!) by including next to no content for the two NEW features it offers, the sampler and the multipads. If you have the skills and patience and time (who has? :evil: ) you can create your own multipads and sampled sounds, but available content is zero from Roland (while their WS FA series get access to FREE sample sets, just to rub our noses in it!). And third party stuff in E-A7 format is very little (though some is quite good).

As always, Roland get to within sight of the finish line, and then just give up :(

If you can derive some sort of hope from the release of a budget arranger with nothing new in it (even at this price), you are a far more optimistic person than me! I have watched Roland slip from the heady days of the G1000's dominance to these days of making half-finished low end products that squander what little 'edge' they have with a lack of content...

Content is what makes arrangers. They are not sold to people that want to do everything themselves. Those people buy workstations and big VST/DAW rigs. Arrangers are bought by people that want to turn it on and PLAY! A sampler with no samples, a multipad system with only a tiny handful of patterns, that won't sell arrangers.

The really sad thing is, the BK-9 only needed a serious OS upgrade (no new buttons, sliders, knobs, even sounds) to be a totally dominant arranger at it's price point. Roland stopped short of the finish line, and then wondered why few bought their half-finished arranger. I guess some people are too stupid to learn. :unsure:
Last Edit: 02 Dec 2017 19:03 by Diki.
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New keyboard !!!! E-X20 02 Dec 2017 23:04 #6441

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This time I agree with you DIKI ,the only "optimistic" hope i have is the unpredictable stupid Roland market strategy or better say NON-strategy that can surprise us. I'm so stupid to be optimistic to see "suggest" a new arranger line based on the type number E-X""
Roland at least give us something!!? like the BK9 to continue with :evil:

Roland always had serie's Em serie, E86/E96 , g800/G1000 ,VA5/VA76 ,BK-serie and between individuals
Yes,Stupid discontinue of the BK9 on the moment a lot a customers need replacement (g70 owners ect. where pretty skeptic in the begin on the BK9 now they simply miss there change)
Roland introduce a "bigger" E-a7 at the same price level as there own running BK5
To-me the (half finished)E-a7 is a market orientation.
Now Korg and Yamaha introduce there new high priced TOTL arrangers . Yes i'm optimistic for the year 2018.

Note at the time Roland introduce there GW8 the were on to developed a total new arranger style format a Expand *.stl witch's include varifrase(real-audio) as VA and logic instrument/synth Arpeggio's
By-now we haven't see anything like that!

My Last request for Roland as long this site is alive and hopefully continue!! (i'm sure they monitor this site!)
Make a crossover from FA-07 and BK9 suggest <<E-AX76>> it will be genius !!! not to say GENOS
For 2018.... Roland arranger MOTL/TOTL market is finally Dead or Alive ???

See you all into a hopefull future with Roland arrangers and this forum otherwise we will meet on other keyboard forums. :whistle:
Last Edit: 02 Dec 2017 23:20 by aviro.
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New keyboard !!!! E-X20 03 Dec 2017 14:21 #6442

  • Wolf
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I do not see a positive future of Roland in the arranger market, because the E-X20 looks pretty similar to the Fame G-300:
www.musicstore.de/en_US/EUR/Fame-G-300-H...d/art-KEY0004457-000
(this Fame 300 keyboard has been available in Music Store for more than 6 months)

For me the interpretation is obvious: Roland asked the manufacturer of the Fame-300 to re-brand the product for Roland and so Roland can sell a cheap keyboard E-X20 without any development costs.
This is in my opinion a sign that Roland just wants to avoid any R&D costs related to arrangers. But collecting other products designed by competitors and re-sell it with a new name, is not a sign of hope - it is a sign of a capitulation.
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New keyboard !!!! E-X20 03 Dec 2017 15:56 #6443

  • flymusic
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This is a copied idea and the concept of Yamaha PSR-Exx series but much simpler and poorer in options.

in.yamaha.com/en/products/musical_instru.../psr-e353/index.html
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New keyboard !!!! E-X20 03 Dec 2017 18:05 #6444

  • loshk
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You rightly think. It really is almost a copy of Fame 300 (from the photo, Why does Fame G-300 cost only 100 euros?).
But think, why does Roland do this?
Roland thinks only about business and does not think about musicians.
And now let's say - how old are we?
Mostly we are from 40 to 70 years old.
We already took place as musicians and we already bought everything basically.
Roland is counting on a young audience.
But young people are less engaged in music than you.
Young people do not like to play alone (this needs a lot to learn), but they like only to press the PLAY button on the MP3 player. :(
Roland E-80 v.2.01 (SRX-01, 02, 10), Roland M-GS64, Roland XV-5050, Ketron SD-2, Edirol PCR-500, Edirol M-16-DX, Kawai MAV-8
Last Edit: 10 Dec 2017 19:12 by loshk.
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New keyboard !!!! E-X20 03 Dec 2017 22:47 #6448

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Fame is also Medeli and KURZWEIL is selling the same!!!!!!
Medeli m341/m361, Fame g400 $125
medeli.jpg

roland e-x20 $
e-x20_top_main.jpg

kurzweil kp110 $250
kurzweil-kp110_1_KEY0004618-000.jpg

there are the same and also the spec. are the same!!!! :blink:

Hell Roland :evil:
Last Edit: 03 Dec 2017 23:10 by aviro.
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New keyboard !!!! E-X20 03 Dec 2017 23:25 #6449

  • flymusic
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Every year, more and more nonsense...

Does anyone from the Roland development team reasonably think about the next move?

Is there any end to these stupid surprises from Roland?

Will my BK 9 be the last piece I bought from Roland? :angry:
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New keyboard !!!! E-X20 04 Dec 2017 07:17 #6450

  • loshk
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Aviro write;
Fame is also Medeli and KURZWEIL is selling the same!!!!!!
Medeli m341/m361, Fame g400 $125


I think (almost sure) that all three of the arrangers shown in the photo is made by one factory in China
(or pirated illegal copies, or is the trick of globalization? :woohoo: )
Roland E-80 v.2.01 (SRX-01, 02, 10), Roland M-GS64, Roland XV-5050, Ketron SD-2, Edirol PCR-500, Edirol M-16-DX, Kawai MAV-8
Last Edit: 04 Dec 2017 07:26 by loshk.
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New keyboard !!!! E-X20 04 Dec 2017 09:41 #6451

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The yamaha has only 32 polyphonie, the Roland 128 and even 4 OTS.
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New keyboard !!!! E-X20 04 Dec 2017 09:48 #6452

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Do you think that their schemes are different?
Do they have only a plastic case (electronic housing) the same?
Roland E-80 v.2.01 (SRX-01, 02, 10), Roland M-GS64, Roland XV-5050, Ketron SD-2, Edirol PCR-500, Edirol M-16-DX, Kawai MAV-8
Last Edit: 04 Dec 2017 09:53 by loshk.
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New keyboard !!!! E-X20 04 Dec 2017 12:55 #6453

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Loshk i'm shure the schemes are also the same!!! From al four! fameg400 ,medeli361, kurszweilk110 the specs. sounds,style's,memory are exactly the same!!!!
they write it down on there own way with there own terms on the specs. sheet
I think they share al the same sound chip And i highly believe its the Roland soniccell .All the custom reverence show "surprise high quality sound!!"
So there's something Roland inside!
Note, that Roland doesn't bring the E-x20 on the europe market!!! Here it's already covered by Fame and Kurzweil.
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New keyboard !!!! E-X20 05 Dec 2017 22:07 #6457

  • Diki
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If the BK-9 is the last upper end (note I don't say TOTL... I have always considered the BK-9 as a souped up E60, not a G70 replacement, both price-wise and feature-wise) Roland, they sure went out on a high note.

Could it have been improved? What can't?! :evil:

But is it enough to keep me happy and gigging for the rest of my career?

Why yes, yes it is!

Sure, it's nice to ogle $5000 Genos's, but there are still things I consider vital (a Chord Sequencer, for one!) that even $5k doesn't get you. Too many wanted the BK-9 to be a G80. It never was, never would be. What we got instead was a G70/E60 hybrid, the guts and sound (and much much more!) of a G70, in the lightweight case and keybed of an E60. At $1500 less than a G70.

Bargain of the century!

I hate to say it, but if you can't get your BK-9 to sound as good as a TOTL arranger, buying one isn't going to help! A T5 in unskilled hands sounds little better than a PSR. Same with a Genos. 90% of how good you sound is YOU. The sad truth is, paying nearly triple for an arranger doesn't make your show 3X as good. Maybe 10% better, if that.

I foresee BK-9's as being a 'sleeper' arranger that, now out of production, will be harder and harder to find and get a steal on. Those that have them know how good they are. Those that don't will likely never know! B)
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New keyboard !!!! E-X20 10 Dec 2017 16:52 #6461

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Rebranding Medeli? Has it come to this?

Let us be in no doubt, that's the clearest possible indication that Roland has abandoned the arranger.
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New keyboard !!!! E-X20 10 Dec 2017 17:33 #6462

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Excuse me, but what do you think is more likely?

That Roland have been rebranding for Medeli and Fame, or that they are getting their arrangers from these tiny companies?

I am rather more of the opinion that Roland have been selling these basic arrangers (and probably the soundsets and styles) to these other companies (as many large corporations do) to sell under their own brand, and have now decided to use the same case and hardware to put out their own arranger. Note the increase in polyphony and OTS compared to the lesser brands.

Mind you, either scenario is a poor one for Roland... Still this continued focus on cheap, non-competitive (compared to Y&K's MOTL and TOTL models) arrangers, rather than innovation and refinement (would that they could concentrate on the latter!) of more pro-end arrangers. Sooner or later, when you abandon innovation and refinement, you are doomed to irrelevancy.

But I always like to look at both sides of an issue :evil: Are we starting to go down the same path that happened to 'home organs' in the seventies? I'm pretty sure that the first company to abandon that doomed format had its share of users that were mad they got out of a market the rest hadn't yet seen as doomed. Is Roland simply being smart? Have they seen the writing on the wall? :huh:

The market for hardware keyboards continues to shrink and shrink, software is the dominant form of music production for the home user, loops and beats rules the airwaves and most kids' and young musicians' consciousness. If a hardware music production solution is preferred, the WS is the dominant type of keyboard bought if they don't simply buy a hardware analog synth. Can we blame Roland for seeing this? To continue to plow large chunks of R&D budget into an ever-shrinking market isn't the smartest business decision any company makes :dry:

Perhaps there comes a time when giving up before it drags the company down is the wise choice. Y&K's continued innovation while Roland made mistake after mistake in design and marketing (and rarely rectified them) has resulted in their current 'also-ran' status. Failure to promote and support their latest efforts to catch up and even overtake Y&K (there is much unfulfilled promise with the E-A7) may have been a last gasp. Can one blame Roland for trying to eke a few last dollars out of models they previously let other companies sell under different brands?

I see many parallels to how the home organ slowly died away in the seventies (I'm old enough to remember watching it happen!). I have a suspicion we are watching the same thing happen today. Sure, there were some magnificent instruments made by the last few companies still in the market, but it didn't stop the slide. And those companies that left first and moved on to newer things are now recognized as the smart ones.

Could that be what we are seeing? :dry:
Last Edit: 10 Dec 2017 17:35 by Diki.
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